Quantcast
  • Register
PhysicsOverflow is a next-generation academic platform for physicists and astronomers, including a community peer review system and a postgraduate-level discussion forum analogous to MathOverflow.

Welcome to PhysicsOverflow! PhysicsOverflow is an open platform for community peer review and graduate-level Physics discussion.

Please help promote PhysicsOverflow ads elsewhere if you like it.

News

PO is now at the Physics Department of Bielefeld University!

New printer friendly PO pages!

Migration to Bielefeld University was successful!

Please vote for this year's PhysicsOverflow ads!

Please do help out in categorising submissions. Submit a paper to PhysicsOverflow!

... see more

Tools for paper authors

Submit paper
Claim Paper Authorship

Tools for SE users

Search User
Reclaim SE Account
Request Account Merger
Nativise imported posts
Claim post (deleted users)
Import SE post

Users whose questions have been imported from Physics Stack Exchange, Theoretical Physics Stack Exchange, or any other Stack Exchange site are kindly requested to reclaim their account and not to register as a new user.

Public \(\beta\) tools

Report a bug with a feature
Request a new functionality
404 page design
Send feedback

Attributions

(propose a free ad)

Site Statistics

205 submissions , 163 unreviewed
5,082 questions , 2,232 unanswered
5,353 answers , 22,789 comments
1,470 users with positive rep
820 active unimported users
More ...

  what compactifications of the Poincare group have been studied?

+ 2 like - 0 dislike
872 views

as we know the Poincare group is non-compact. Poincare invariance have been observed in velocities and energies up to $10^{20}$ eV in cosmic rays. The other day i was thinking in how $SU(2)$ homeomorphism in $SO(3)$ imposes a double cover, and i keep wondering if something like that could exist in the Poincare group, but of course the main problem is that the group is not compact.

I wonder if it is possible at all to make a compactification of the Group that is consistent with low-energy physics and still preserves some form of isotropy of space-time. For instance, i considered indentifying the different connected components (either CP or PT inverted) of the group at some boundary consistent with energies of the order of $10^{28}$ eV, but with meaningful dimensional analysis, but have not succeeded analysising the symmetry properties of the resulting manifold and the algebraic properties of it (it is still a Lie group after such identification?)

The physical interpretation of such identification is up to discussion, but i think that it would basically stand for a duality that maps continuously (in the concrete example compactification i gave) particles with energies above $E_p$ (some abritrary boundary energy) with particles with energy below $E_p$ and $P$ or $CP$ reversed. This latter would make for instance, electric charge conservation an approximate symmetry.

Has something like this been attempted? or are there good reasons known why this could not work?

This post has been migrated from (A51.SE)
asked Nov 19, 2011 in Theoretical Physics by CharlesJQuarra (555 points) [ no revision ]
Could you explain what you mean by a group compactification? Do you have an example in mind? The connected component of the identity of the Lorentz group $O(1,3)$ is isomorphic to $PSL_2(\mathbf{C})$, which has an obvious double cover $SL_2(\mathbf{C})$. This also extends to the Poincare group.

This post has been migrated from (A51.SE)
well, thats the part i'm not sure because i don't know if there is a well-defined compactification procedure for groups as there are for manifolds. What i was hoping is to take the Lie group as a manifold, apply the compactification (basically by identifying it with other stuff at a prescribed boundary), and see what "needs to happen" in the boundary so that the resulting manifold is still a Lie group

This post has been migrated from (A51.SE)
The double cover of the identity component of the Poincare group is a standard object. There is no problem with the group being non-compact

This post has been migrated from (A51.SE)

1 Answer

+ 6 like - 0 dislike

You cannot embed the Poincare group or the Lorentz group into a compact Lie group $G$. Indeed, denote the Lie algebra of $G$ as $\mathfrak{g}$ and the Lorentz algebra as $\mathfrak{l}=\mathfrak{o}(1,3)\cong\mathfrak{sl}_2(\mathbf{C})$.

The Killing form on $\mathfrak{g}$ is non-positive-definite, but then so is its restriction to $\mathfrak{l}$. Restriction of the Killing form on $\mathfrak{g}$ to $\mathfrak{l}$ is $\mathfrak{l}$-invariant and is therefore proportional to the Killing form on $\mathfrak{l}$, since the latter is a simple real Lie algebra. Finally, the Killing form on $\mathfrak{l}$ has signature $(3,3)$, contradiction.

By the same reasoning, you cannot mod out by a discrete subgroup of the Lorentz group and get a compact group: the Lie algebra does not change, so the Killing form cannot become non-positive-definite.

On the other hand, there are well-known 'compactifications' of the translation group. You can either mod out $\mathbf{R}/\mathbf{Z}=S^1$ or immerse $\mathbf{R}\rightarrow T^2$ as an irrational winding depending on what kind of compactifications you are interested in.

This post has been migrated from (A51.SE)
answered Nov 19, 2011 by Pavel Safronov (1,120 points) [ no revision ]

Your answer

Please use answers only to (at least partly) answer questions. To comment, discuss, or ask for clarification, leave a comment instead.
To mask links under text, please type your text, highlight it, and click the "link" button. You can then enter your link URL.
Please consult the FAQ for as to how to format your post.
This is the answer box; if you want to write a comment instead, please use the 'add comment' button.
Live preview (may slow down editor)   Preview
Your name to display (optional):
Privacy: Your email address will only be used for sending these notifications.
Anti-spam verification:
If you are a human please identify the position of the character covered by the symbol $\varnothing$ in the following word:
p$\hbar$ysicsOverflo$\varnothing$
Then drag the red bullet below over the corresponding character of our banner. When you drop it there, the bullet changes to green (on slow internet connections after a few seconds).
Please complete the anti-spam verification




user contributions licensed under cc by-sa 3.0 with attribution required

Your rights
...