Quantcast
  • Register
PhysicsOverflow is a next-generation academic platform for physicists and astronomers, including a community peer review system and a postgraduate-level discussion forum analogous to MathOverflow.

Welcome to PhysicsOverflow! PhysicsOverflow is an open platform for community peer review and graduate-level Physics discussion.

Please help promote PhysicsOverflow ads elsewhere if you like it.

News

PO is now at the Physics Department of Bielefeld University!

New printer friendly PO pages!

Migration to Bielefeld University was successful!

Please vote for this year's PhysicsOverflow ads!

Please do help out in categorising submissions. Submit a paper to PhysicsOverflow!

... see more

Tools for paper authors

Submit paper
Claim Paper Authorship

Tools for SE users

Search User
Reclaim SE Account
Request Account Merger
Nativise imported posts
Claim post (deleted users)
Import SE post

Users whose questions have been imported from Physics Stack Exchange, Theoretical Physics Stack Exchange, or any other Stack Exchange site are kindly requested to reclaim their account and not to register as a new user.

Public \(\beta\) tools

Report a bug with a feature
Request a new functionality
404 page design
Send feedback

Attributions

(propose a free ad)

Site Statistics

206 submissions , 164 unreviewed
5,103 questions , 2,249 unanswered
5,355 answers , 22,794 comments
1,470 users with positive rep
820 active unimported users
More ...

  Equivalence of definitions of ADM Mass

+ 7 like - 0 dislike
1330 views

ADM Mass is a useful measure of a system. It is often defined (Wald 293)

$$M_{ADM}=\frac{1}{16\pi} \lim_{r \to \infty} \oint_{s_r} (h_{\mu\nu,\mu}-h_{\mu\mu,\nu})N^{\nu} dA$$

Where $s_r$ is two sphere with a radius going to infinity.

However, I have also seen the following definition (EDIT: for example, Page 147 of "A Relativists Toolkit"):

$$M_{ADM} = - \frac{1}{8\pi} \lim_{r \to \infty} \oint_{s_r}(H-H_0)\sqrt{\sigma}d^2\theta$$

Where $H_0$ is the extrinsic curvature of $s_r$ embedded in flat space and $H$ is the extrinsic curvature of $s_t$ embedded on a hypersurface of the spacetime.

It is not overly clear to me how these two are related. Obvious we can get the same differential with the follow definition.

$$dA=\sqrt{\sigma}d^2\theta$$

But more so than that it doesn't seem clear why those extrinsic curvatures should be equal to those metric derivatives (times the constant term of $-1/2$). Presumably the fact that we are taking the limit out to $r \to \infty$ is important as we are assuming that the metric should be asymptotically flat (or at least asymptotically constant metric) and these quantities might be reduced to some similar form in the limit.

Any insight?

This post has been migrated from (A51.SE)
asked Mar 13, 2012 in Theoretical Physics by Benjamin Horowitz (195 points) [ no revision ]
retagged Apr 19, 2014 by dimension10
Could you tell us more about the second expression; I have not seen it before. Maybe source an example where they use it?

This post has been migrated from (A51.SE)
Page 147 of "A Relativists Toolkit"

This post has been migrated from (A51.SE)
Maybe discussion on p469 of Wald can help? especially E.2.46 and 2.47.

This post has been migrated from (A51.SE)

2 Answers

+ 2 like - 0 dislike

Your second expression, when the integral is not taken at infinity, is usually known as either the Brown-York or Hawking-Horowitz (quasilocal) mass. It is closely related to the Liu-Yau mass. For a finite radius sphere, it is not equal to the ADM integral in general.

In the original paper of Brown and York, they asserted but did not provide (as far as I can tell) a detailed proof of the asymptotic behaviour of the quasilocal mass. But if you consider an asymptotically flat space-time and take asymptotic Euclidean coordinates, a direct computation should show that the $K_0\to 0$ as a sphere goes to "infinity" (since coordinate spheres in Euclidean space has mean curvature decaying to 0 as the radius increases), and the decay conditions on the metric and the second fundamental form of the spatial slice should guarantee that the difference between $K$ and the coordinate derivative expression tends to zero. (Remember that the space-time mean curvature can be computed from the mean curvature of the spatial slice embedded in the space-time together with the mean curvature of the two sphere embedded in the spatial slice.)

Similar computations were also performed by Brewin.

The convergence of the Brown-York mass to the ADM mass is also recovered in this paper of Miao, Shi, and Tam.

This post has been migrated from (A51.SE)
answered Mar 26, 2012 by Willie Wong (580 points) [ no revision ]
+ 1 like - 0 dislike

First, let's try and clean up the MTW expression a little bit by getting rid of the manifestly coordinate variant stuff, by introducing a proper contraction, a proper integral over the surface at infinity, and the unit normal $r^{a}$ to the surface at infinity:

$$M_{ADM}={16\pi}\oint\sqrt{\gamma}\,\,d^{2}x \gamma^{ab}r^{c}\left(\gamma_{ac,b}-\gamma_{ab,c}\right)$$

This is only valid, however, not just only for in asymptotically flat spaces, but actually only for asymptotically Cartesian coordinates. You can prove this to yourself by calculating the ``ADM Mass'' of the flat 3-metric in polar coordinates:

$\begin{align*} 16\pi M_{ADM}&=\lim_{r\rightarrow\infty}\oint r^{2}\sin\theta \gamma^{ab}\left(\gamma_{ra,b}-\gamma_{ab,r}\right)d\theta d\phi\\ &=\lim_{r\rightarrow\infty}4\pi r^{2}\left(\gamma^{rr}\gamma_{rr,r}-\gamma^{ab}\gamma_{ab,r}\right)\\ &=\lim_{r\rightarrow\infty}4\pi r^{2}\left(0-\frac{4}{r}\right)\\ &=-\infty \end{align*}$

Obviously, this is wrong, and just an artifact of the way that spherical coordinates behave at infinity. To fix this, we need to always subtract the divergence from the ADM mass of flat spacetime from the ADM mass of the coordinate system in question. So, that's the origin of the $H$ and $H_{0}$ terms. The $H$ term is the extrinsic curvature of the space in question, while $H_{0}$ is the extrinsic curvature of flat spacetime. Now, it's just a matter of showing that the expression inside the integral is equal to $H$.

Typically, I define the extrinsic curvature as $\gamma^{ab}\nabla_{a}r_{b}$. So, let's go on an adventure:

$\begin{align*} H&=\gamma^{ab}\nabla_{a}r_{b}\\ &=\gamma^{ab}\left(\partial_{a}r_{b}-\Gamma_{ab}{}^{c}r_{c}\right)\\ &=\gamma^{ab}\partial_{a}r_{b}-\frac{1}{2}\gamma^{ab}\gamma^{cd}\left(2\gamma_{ad,b}-\gamma_{ab,d}\right)r_{c}\\ &=\gamma^{ab}\partial_{a}\left(\gamma_{bc}r^{c}\right)-\gamma^{ab}r^{c}\left(\gamma_{ac,b}-\frac{1}{2}\gamma_{ab,c}\right)\\ &=\delta^{a}{}_{c}\partial_{a}r^{c} + \gamma^{ab}r^{c}\gamma_{bc,a}-\gamma^{ab}r^{c}\left(\gamma_{ac,b}-\frac{1}{2}\gamma_{ab,c}\right)\\ &=\partial_{a}r^{a}+\frac{1}{2}\gamma^{ab}r^{c}\left(\gamma_{ac,b}-\gamma_{ab,c}\right) \end{align*}$

Now, we note that in any coodinate system adapted so that the coordinate $r=constant$ that determines the surface is chosen for one of the coordinates, we have, necessarily have $r^{a}=(1,0,0)$, we note that $\partial_{a}r^{a}=0$, and we thus conclude that the two expressions for ADM mass are equivalent.

This post has been migrated from (A51.SE)
answered Apr 13, 2012 by jerryschirmer (250 points) [ no revision ]

Your answer

Please use answers only to (at least partly) answer questions. To comment, discuss, or ask for clarification, leave a comment instead.
To mask links under text, please type your text, highlight it, and click the "link" button. You can then enter your link URL.
Please consult the FAQ for as to how to format your post.
This is the answer box; if you want to write a comment instead, please use the 'add comment' button.
Live preview (may slow down editor)   Preview
Your name to display (optional):
Privacy: Your email address will only be used for sending these notifications.
Anti-spam verification:
If you are a human please identify the position of the character covered by the symbol $\varnothing$ in the following word:
p$\hbar$ysics$\varnothing$verflow
Then drag the red bullet below over the corresponding character of our banner. When you drop it there, the bullet changes to green (on slow internet connections after a few seconds).
Please complete the anti-spam verification




user contributions licensed under cc by-sa 3.0 with attribution required

Your rights
...